It happens all the time. Common boundary fences - an owner's 30-day notice to - firsttuesday We offered to replace it along the Western boundary as a courtesy and allow their cattle to continue to graze on our prospective land. I appreciate your comment, but you must realize the majority of the time, these cases will be fought in small claims court by neighbors without much legal knowledge or without additional attorneys and the judge will likely follow the letter of the law. Only one of them communicated this to us. Apparently our fence was in bad shape, and the townhouses owners wanted it removed because they thought it was ugly. After the new fence has been constructed, neighbors will continue to share costs of upkeep and fence repairs. I have a shared fence with my neighbor and we plan to share the cost of a new fence equally since it collapsed with strong winds a few months ago. Or, with a good neighbor fence you don't have to worry about that issue. Hope this fully answers your question, if you have any further questions please let us know. HOA Ruining Your Life? 8 Unenforceable HOA Rules - realtor.com If he continues to do so anyway, call the cops. No, this will not cause any issues whatsoever. They have the planks on their side and our side has the 2x4s. Your article however is stating there is a State law that says otherwise. However they want to put a new retaining concrete wall and then put the fence on top. Pics and docs of the current properties fencing This means he has direct line of sight into my entire front yard, and we can walk into each others side yards if feeling entitled. 510-1600 Carling Avenue. Property managers or rental property management companies whose clients properties are affected by this new law must be mindful of the change and be aware of the procedural requirements dictated by the state legislature. It leaves me in this terrible circle. Especially since they are quite a bit more expensive and in theory will last a lifetime. The neighbor does not want to share the cost to fix it, and states it is my sole responsibility. Perhaps you recently purchased a home and the fence seems to violate the laws that youve researched, but its possible the fence can remain. Fight it until the very end! First off, does she have the expertise to build a fence like a company that specializes in building fences and provides a warranty, which your not going to get with her? He has the responsibility to pay for half of a fence between yards. I have offered to help with the labor and split the cost 50/50. He offered to remove our old wooden fence for $600.00. Only if the collapsing fence is a danger and your neighbour is refusing to take responsibility, are you within your rights to report this to your local council who may be able to enforce your. She does not want to do it that way. 5) Any other equitable factors appropriate under the circumstances. Is there anything I can do to stop neighbors from bullying me? Shared Fences: Everything You Need to Know in 2023 California's Good Neighbor Fence Law RC Fences and Decks There were 3 major mistakes on his part. The neighbor paying (if you are not splitting the cost) would have the right to insist that the good side be pointed towards his yard. Investigate your states statutes, countys zoning ordinances, and HOAs Covenants, Conditions, and Restrictions (CC&Rs) and bylaws. Is Your Association Ready for a Recession? For a backyard fence, the maximum height is 72 inches. Except on the front portion which is in my front yard. Are they responsible for paying for half of the fence that runs along their easement, even if the fence doesnt border their yard? By respecting the boundary fence, you can avoid awkward confrontations and instead nurture healthy relationships with your neighbors. First off, they cannot tell you not to touch the fence at all, the fence as long as it is on the property line is both your neighbor and your property and therefore you have just as much right to it as they do, whether or not they paid for it. For those who manage properties for clients here is where you need to pay attention. It just appeared one day. Were going through a similar situation. The case law for boundary fences is found in . While these panels may look nice on the store shelves, they are made from inferior wood products and generally all the lumber is dimensionally smaller. The back part of the fence, in the backyard, fell and is neighboring half of the neighbors front yard. I had contacted my neighbor twice that we need to get the fence fix. Even in non-typical cases, both parties are 50/50 responsible. Will we need to pay? We wanted to replace it and he said we need 3 bids, my wife worked for months to get 3 bids and when we presented him with these he promptly said he could not afford to replace the fence. I think that the cost split should be 60/40 with 60% of the cost incurred by the neighbor that has the finished side facing their yard and 40% incurred by the neighbor with the post side facing their yard. If you are inferring above that another option would be to repair, then you have missed the actual basis for this article. Please note that this article should not replace professional legal advice but merely inform you of publicly available information for your state. She is seriously the neighbor of nightmares and this is why people need to understand what it means to live in an HOA community. What is it and How Will it Help Me? After I threaten to take him to a small claims court. They had a 5 day notice from time of the written letter to the fence being repaired. The fence is old and rotted and they have ivy growing on it which has helped to cause it to fall into my yard. So you are presented with the same predicament? You may already have a good idea of where the boundary is between your property and your neighbor's, and even if there is already a fence there, you should still consider legally establishing the property line before building or replacing a fence. Some states define use as occupancy - such as using the land up to the fence . Not only did you not own the house when it was replaced, but even if you did, they would have to give you a 30-day notice if you refused to pay half. The development has remained pretty much the same over the years, and only a handful of people chose to put up decorative front yard fences. Sometimes even a hedge can act as a boundary. 167, 168; Griffin v. Sansom, 72 S.W. It covers issues such as cost-sharing, location and the standard of dividing fences and sets out procedures for carrying out the work and resolving disputes. Lastly, the neighbor failed to serve the notice to you. Are we under any legal obligation to pay him a penny? Part of our fence fell down last year we contacted the gentelman who owns the home ( its a rental) and has a pool. What constitutes "use " varies by state. Certified letter of intent Nolan v. Mendere, 14 S.W. He should have sent the notice to you 30 days prior to the construction of the fence and should have sent it to you certified mail with the return receipt requested. There is a fence that runs right through our parcel it is aprox. For example, your HOA may mandate fences be no less than five feet (5) tall and no more than six feet (6) wide. They can't force you to pay for a replacement fence unless there was something structurally wrong with the previous fence. The second and third reasons only apply if the fence needed to be replaced in the first place, but I will touch on them anyway. We have a plant bed with a little two inch wooden retaining wall on our property to keep the soil in place. Hi we live in a resort area and our neighbor who does not live full time at his home, wants a fence between our yards to keep his dog in, privacy, etc. I hope this answers your question somewhat good luck with your neighbor! Thanks. Spite Fence Law: 841.4; Tree Trimming: 733; 833-834; 622; 384a(2) Boundary Fences. In that case, you could hire an attorney who can clarify the details of your local ordinances and laws that govern shared fences. First point I made was that dont want a wooden fence due to the upkeep of it. In this scenario, would the State law trump the city? Why would this be true.. the fence is not on the boundary like therefore it is the responsibility of the property owner in which has the entirety of the fence on their property to maintain it as they like. for court! I do not think this qualifies for a Good neighbor fence. Part of California fence law, California Civil Code 841, describes the rights and responsibilities of those who share a fence along a mutual boundary line. Does this remove us from mutual benefit responsibilities and paying half of the replacement? Once your neighbor sees that you are suing him for considerably more than half the cost of the fence that you initially requested he will likely want to pay you the initial amount immediately. It clashed with the style of our house. This prevents a neighbor from getting only 1 bid (maybe a family member) and going with them despite the fact they might have little experience and be charging an exuberant fee. Thank you for your article. Neighbor wants to replace fallen fence due to construction on his property. I want to replace our fence and sent multiple notices to our neighbor south of us. We live on a hillside, so our backyard is 3 stories down. There were no fences and the neighborhood kids played freely in the yards from house to house. While I understand the question is a general legal question and the contractor area of expertise does not matter, I would still feel more comfortable directing you to a knowledgeable attorney in your area! Maldri, I would recommend that you try and sit down with your neighbor and explain to them that the wall they built along with the overwatering is causing the fence to fail prematurely and see if they are willing to make the necessary changes to prevent this from continuing to take place. I mentioned it to my neighbor and he does not see anything wrong with the two fences. On the invoice, the contractor put good neighbor fence. Is this considered a good neighbor fence under these circumstances? I know I cant remove the 3 foot rod iron fence because it is totally on his property but can I remove the 6 foot fence that is on my property? Although you didnt follow the steps necessary under the CA Good Neighbor Law, if it were me I would go ahead and take him to small claims court. This is because adjoining landowners are equally responsible for the costs of construction, maintenance, and any needed replacement of the fence. I was advised by the HOA board about Cal. Redwood trees at top of slope in his his corner hides the fencing in this area. 578 University Avenue, Palo Alto, CA 94301 He then ghosted me, my mother. Still, we would have been happy to go 50/50 on a new fence but they did not inform us and did ask for us to help pay for a new fence. This is true even if you currently have a friendly relationship with the other property owners you want to have a shared fence with. The neighbor cannot afford to pay their equal share due to financial hardship. Fencing Laws and Your Neighbors: FAQs - FindLaw I have a neighbor that replaced my fence on one side. Surprisingly I get a txt from the neighbor that he doesnt approve of the vinyl fence and wants a wooden fence because he feels it makes his house look bad. A dividing fence is a fence built to separate two pieces of adjoining land. Secondly, is the fact that she is stating the material are the same costs as the labor; that would be a huge red flag for me. Never allowed us to consider disparate bids. Not your property, not your fence. A solution to the problem: A clear explanation of how your action will correct the problem. Whether you received it or not, if he lacks proof, it will do him no good in court. You bring up replacement due to aesthetics and upgrading a fence? I didnt even have the option of getting my own bids or anything. My new neighbor just started replacing all his fencing in his backyard. The neighbors called and threatened to sue us. 3 quotes My relationship with this neighbor is not good. Whos responsible? The next day, while I was gone, the neighbor came to my wife very agitated and critical, saying, how inconsiderate this was for us to do, how could we, and it was his fence and we were using it and encroaching on his property. Whether it be your personal garden, hidden oasis, or outdoor sanctuary, your backyard is your business or is it? The statute provides that in the event there is a subsequent dispute about the shared fencing project, a court shall order contribution of the reasonable costs of construction or maintenance of the fencing, unless the adjoining landowner either rebuts the presumption or demonstrates a financial hardship. This is why I believe it is best in your situation to try and come to an agreement amicably with your neighbor! Are we liable for half of what we dont want, what didnt exist, and what only benefits the other party? Partition fence Hog fencing. Property owners can't use barbed wire in a boundary fences unless neighboring property owner agrees. Impeachment of assessment Damages. Unless adjoining landowners agree to place a fence along boundary, you can only erect fence within the bounds of your own property. I said great, but I would throw the neighbors a bone and, as a curtsey, pay them something. The term good neighbor just refers to the style of the fence. The slats are winged vinyl so I have to poison from above and it is becoming too big of a job. 864, 864; Spite Fences: Harrison v. Langlinais, 312 S.W . I wish I could help you, if you live around the Concord, CA. See The 2015 Trends in Home Remodeling, California Top Real Estate Trends for 2015. By working together and following proper process, a satisfactory outcome is more likely. A boundary fence, also called a division fence or partition fence, is a fence that is located on the line between two properties and is used by both owners. Any thoughts not input would be greatly appreciated. I had not notified him yet of the contractor doing the job as it just got scheduled. The new neighbor had a dog and wished to build a fenced-in yard, the 1st on our side of the street. The statute provides that if the neighbor does not follow the statutory notice procedures, the neighbor cannot later seek contribution to the cost of the fence from the neighbor who was not given proper notice. Make a demand to the neighbor for half of the costs. I understood and said whatever wood you do your fence we can get. what if my dog runs off? I signed a contract and the day before installation neighbor said no, fence could not be removed, so I had to have it installed on my side (plus pay the total $3000). It's important to understand the guidelines around fences built on shared property lines. The sides of our yard are 6 white vinyl. We will save that for another conversation. A backyard fence that splits the property lines between neighbors is called a boundary fence. Good luck with the whole situation and please come back and let us know how everything turned out once the ordeal is over! Consequently, when a fence needs repair, both property owners must share the cost. This means that your neighbor (s) have the same rights to the shared fence as you do. The main one being, that they dont benefit from the erection of said fence. There is a brick wall between me and my neighbor. Having said this I can see where he is coming from, many people are still on the fence as to whether they like the look of vinyl fence yet. Every property on the North side has the planks and the on Southern fence you have the 2x4s. I would send them a letter certified mail with return receipt requested (for proof should you need it down the road) to immediately stop[ all harassment against you, state that you will not be paying them a dime as you were not the homeowner at the time of replacement, and should they wish to take you to court, go ahead! I also gave him the link to the brochure from the manufacturer which has multiple darker wooden although they cost 40% more. Still proceed to have the fence repaired and then take her to small claims? Maybe higher. First off, if there was no fence there already you shouldnt have to pay anything, especially if it will not finish enclosing your yard giving you that security benefit. If youre not in compliance, your fence will be a source of frustrating fence disputes with your otherwise friendly neighbors. If so, can I put up planks on my side, once its built? They replaced it a couple of times, and eventually changed the style to a more traditional looking front yard fence. Also during the raining season, we need to do the roof and siding work asap before the raining season. In some places, you need a permit regardless of how high your fence is. If this sounds similar to your situation then I believe our article can be very helpful. Am I Obligated to Pay for Half of a Shared Fence? - Tierney Stauffer LLP I noticed this when it was almost done. By Brian Farkas, Attorney Question My neighbor wants to replace her entire fence, including a panel between our two properties. For the law to be on his side he would have had to give you a 30 day Notice to Alter Shared Boundary. Yes, that is correct. Now Im waiting for a response but Ive already put down a deposit and the contractor seems like a good guy so Im not completely worried that I cant get my money back. Next door landlord(just purchased the land) approach me daughter of owner of the house & ask to sloppy cost on shared fence that was very water damaged. Whether they are facing financial hardships of their own, are very tight with their money, or just take no pride in the upkeep of their property, the refusal usually comes from the misconception that they are not legally responsible to pay. Most houses have nothing between them in the front yards other than a concrete mowing strip or plants, if anything. But did not want to go through our contractors. If you dont agree to her doing the job, which I would be very wary of and personally would never allow, then she has no choice but to pay for it all herself or you guys use a different contractor. If you do go ahead and put up a fence on a shared boundary line, there are other costs to keep in mind. But we do not like the look of vinyl fence. Can she force me to pay for the materials and she do the labor? -Was the wall there from the very beginning when the houses were built or is it because of some type of new construction? If he followed these steps then he could go after you in court and would likely win. Once you get three estimates from reputable companies, present them to her, then decide on a fence contractor, and send your neighbor the 30-day notice. I am not quite sure I fully understand your question. Your certificate of title and local council bylaws may have information about who needs to pay for repairs. If one party refuses to cooperate, the other party can do any of the following: The definition regarding Join for Use is likely going to be a major factor in deciding who is legally responsible to pay. Fence Building Law Basics for Homeowners - The Spruce It does not extend the full length of the front yard (only about 15 feet of 45 or so). This was not a tornado , ir hurricane , and there was no other wind damage in the neighborhood . 2023 shellyrobersonrealtor.com | Powered by, What the New Shared Fence Law Means to You, Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on LinkedIn (Opens in new window), Click to share on Reddit (Opens in new window), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Pinterest (Opens in new window), Click to share on Tumblr (Opens in new window), Click to email a link to a friend (Opens in new window). Seems your neighbor would be reaping the rewards with no out of pocket costs for him. Our neighbors property has their front yard side fence built on their property, parallel to our fence, about 16 inches from our fence along the entire way. At the very least, even if your neighbor doesnt see your side of the issue and still believes both of you should split the costs evenly, hopefully, you can convey the importance of proper care and maintanence for the new fence in the future to prevent another similar issue down the road. If they dont listen, then you can inform them you are monitoring and documenting the issue and when the time comes to replace the fence you will not be paying 50% of the costs due to their actions causing the premature failure. Im in LA county and spoke with a small claims advisor they said that I could sue for half the cost of the job with quotes, but apparently a judge cant order for the consent of the job, but I figure at that point if youve already had to pay you might as well agree to the fix. Would you please comment on this: After getting the small claims judgement, and the other party still refuses to pay, get the judgement RECORDED, as it then attaches to the property. The law also states that the written notice needs to include information on the presumption of equal responsibility for the costs of construction and maintenance. Would we lose in small claims court? Sharing expenses of partition fence. But, our neighbor says that vinyl fence is the cheapest. Paying in full and go to court is not a good resolution to this situation. This is if you dont take the proper steps leading up to the construction of the fence. A Guide to Texas Fence Laws | GetJerry.com Having said this I do not believe what your neighbor has done is in any way illegal and I must warn you should you take this stance and they go about replacing the fence according to the steps necessary in the CA good neighbor law, then you would likely lose in court. They want us to pay for 1/2 of the repair. Anyway, can they sue me for 1/2 the cost of this ? Hes going forward with it and we will get the framed side. Am I supposed to send another certified letter with the bids on replacing the fence and give them a demand again or just go to small claims court and ask the judge to rule that they need to split the cost on fixing the fence? Fencing on Property Line: Who Pays for and Maintains It? I do not see why you wouldnt be able to do what youre proposing except for the fact that it could bring along with it a lot of issues. If they refuse to pay for half the costs, then Yes you can still take them to small claims court. Local ordinances, state laws and regulations, homeowners associations, land-use restrictions, and more all have a role to play in determining who pays for boundary fences between neighbors. We agreed. The neighbor has a large tree that pushed against the fence along with an old mattress behind their shed that did not help with the fence integrity. Ottawa, Ontario. Also, the fence was still in decent shape and we hadnt planned on replacing soon. I Said they should of waited till the house was under my name and I would of helped out. Fencing law What are your rights and obligations when fencing your boundary? The fence has deteriorated and a section has fallen over. In California, two people whose properties border each other are both required to maintain an existing fence between the properties, with only a few exceptions. This is important because if the fence turned out to be wholly on your own property, the cost of the fence and any fence maintenance or upkeep would be your financial responsibility instead of a shared investment with your neighbor. Only 43 of that fence serves me, and then my gate encloses my yard. Ergeon can provide bill splitting and invoice each neighbor separately to make the process more seamless.. Do we owe anyliability and responsibility to the neighbors? It benefits the homeowners as they now have a legal route to take to replace their fences, which obviously is exactly the reason the law was created! If you cant abide by the rules that make the neighborhood clean and what probably attracted you to purchase in the first place, buy elsewhere! Palo Alto Wants to Shift Drivers to Trains and Buses, What Californias Water-Saving Plumbing Law Means to You, In My Opinion Pocket Listings Dont Help Home Sellers, Attention Downsizing Baby Boomers Sell Your House, Protect All Your Equity, and Pay NO Capital Gains Taxes with this Simple Strategy Using Tools Congress Gave Us, Palo Alto Chamber of Commerce Moving to Lytton Gateway, Palo Alto Considers Citywide Residential Parking Permit Program, How To Avoid The Big Housing Crunch Awaiting Many Baby Boomers. I will now finish the fence, pay 100%, block his view of my yard, and recapture my privacy. Hi Annie, thanks for the great question! Now as far as the law is concerned although your neighbor is not being a very good neighbor nor is he being very diplomatic, but I believe he still has a right to refuse the vinyl fencing whether or not he is paying a dime. Well, I wish I could give you better advice but the matter is in your neighbors hands. Im looking forward to returning to your website. I have video documentation of the damage . 2. Thanks! The fence is solely your responsibility. Ive got all my quotes and now guess what.. none of them will agree to the job unless both homeowners consent! 26, 138 A. Does it? Some years back, with consent from the prior owner of the neighboring house, my husband paid for and built a fence in our FRONT yard between our driveway and neighbors side yard for growing plants on (decorative). You can check if it's a party wall on GOV.UK. It is very good you havent paid anything for it yet. Yet, if the yards were already fenced in previously, and if you have other fences connecting to the one in question, you are more than likely going to get a judgment against you for half the cost. We deal solely with fences and decks and not siding, etc. They told me that as long as I dont pay then Im not allowed to touch their wall at all and they were going to take me to small claims for them to collect what I owed them. Our situation is different then all the comments I have read. I am very sorry to hear about your situation. This means that decisions about building or replacing fences need to be made together with your neighboring homeowners. Prior existing law enacted in 1872 which required a landowner who fully enclosed a property to refund their neighbor a just proportion of the value of a division fence is repealed due to this new law. They said that would be a civil dispute amongst neighbors. this information even though informative it only benefit the contractor. Please let us know what better route there is to take, I am sure all our readers as well as I would love to hear all the other options out there! Assuming your neighbor will pay half is incorrect. We just accepted that it was their fence, since we didnt approve it to be on the property line or attached to the main sideyard fence, and we were forbidden to touch it. By reading the law it seems like I dont really need his permission to build the fence due to its condition and previous incidents but Im trying to keep the peace. Is there a time when a neighbor should be forced to contribute to a fence cost when it has become a nuisance/eyesore or simple does not function for what its purpose is any longer and cannot be repaired without incurring considerable cost?
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